The publishers got together
建立了自我审查团体
and set up a self-censorship organization.
名叫漫画法典管理局
It’s the comics code authority.
他必须把每本漫画都送去他们会决定
He had to send every book to that group,
经过审查的漫画具有教育性
and they said,
这本太暴♥力♥ 那本太煽情
“well, this is too violent,” or, “that’s too sexy.”
他们会在封面上盖上审查通过章
And they would get the stamp of approval on the cover,
上面写“本书内容无害”
which said this was a decent publication.
寻找有此章的漫画
出版商都不敢
The publishers were scared
布莱恩·本迪斯 《终极蜘蛛侠》作家
出版被视作有问题的作品
to publish material that would be deemed questionable.
魏特汉的书上市后
Kirby: After Wertham published his book,
诱惑无辜
the comic-book industry,
漫画产业受到重创
I mean, really took a nose dive.
超过八百个人失业
Over 800 people lost their jobs.
30到40间漫画公♥司♥宣布倒闭
30 to 40 comic-book companies went out of business.
数个月后仅剩下不到十间公♥司♥
Within months, it was down to 10 or fewer.
剩下的也都岌岌可危
And those were struggling.
那段时间是漫画的停工期他们急速消失
So it was kind of a down time for comics. They were fading out like crazy.
明天 看看我们战后的世界
Tomorrow, previewing our post-war world.
我们来看看全新的发展
Let’s look into a brand-new development …
电视机
television.
电视机出现 孩子的看书时间变少
Man: Television came in. Kids were reading less.
美国逐渐安定 漫画反映出那一点
Steranko: America was settling down. Comics reflected that.
战争结束了
The war ended.
每个超级英雄都被送去炼狱
Every superhero went to purgatory.
就连美国队长都宣布停业
Even Captain America closed shop.
超级英雄在1950年代起不了效用
Superheroes just didn’t seem to work in the 1950s.
惊悚漫画比超级英雄更受欢迎
Horror was more popular than superheroes,
《威胁》
那就是为何《美国队长》系列的最后几集
which is why the last few issues of the Captain America series
叫做《美国队长怪谈》
are called Captain America’s Weird Tales.
当时我忙着写出版商马丁·古德曼
At that time, all I did was write the kind of stories
想要我写的故事
that the publisher, Martin Goodman, wanted me to write.
《牙爪王》
古德曼追随潮流
Goodman chased trends.
《完整西部杂♥志♥》
《铁匠蒂莉》当时是很受欢迎的连载漫画
You know, tillie the toiler was popular in the newspaper strips.
古德曼会说“给我那种故事”
Goodman would say, “give me some of those,”
《打字小姐泰丝》就此诞生
and you’d get Tessie the typist.
《护士妮莉》-《模特儿米丽》
Lee: Nellie the nurse. – Millie the model.
《好莱坞海蒂》
Hedy of Hollywood.
漫画内容越发贫乏
Comic books were just slumming.
在我们之前出现的那批人
O’Neil: The early guys … the guys before us …
不是看漫画长大的
didn’t grow up reang comics.
他们发明了这种形式
They invented the form,
他们发明了这种形式但以此为耻
and they were ashamed of that.
我甚至改名
I even changed my name
从原本正常的斯坦利·李伯
from Stanley Leiber, which was a normal name,
改成斯坦·李
to Stan Lee.
我不希望大家把斯坦利·李伯跟漫画作家连在一起
I didn’t want Stanley Leiber to be known as a comic-book writer.
若我参加派对 有人问起我的职业
If I was at a party, and they said, “what do you do?”
我说我是画漫画的
“I work in comic books.”
交谈就此结束
that ended the conversation.
我说我真的厌倦
I said, “I’m really sick
创作这些毫无意涵的故事
“of writing these stories that mean nothing.
故事毫无看头
They’re not well-written.
《怪谈》
没有任何特色
They don’t have any characterization.
它们只是人们看过就忘的故事
They’re just stories. People read them and forget them.”
我告诉我的妻子我想辞职
I told my wife that I wanted to quit.
最后在1961年 我猜当时
Finally, in 1961, I guess that’s when …
漫画产业濒临倒闭
I guess they were on the verge of just closing it all down.
不管你相信与否
Believe it or not,
我们最爱的英雄和他们受人喜爱的另一个自我
some of our favorite heroes and their beloved alter egos
可能根本不存在
may have never existed
如果不是因为杰克·科比
had it not been for the creativity and boldness
史蒂夫·迪特科和斯坦·李的创意及大胆
of Jack Kirby, Steve Ditko, and Stan Lee.
斯坦已经在这行打滚了20多年
Stan had been in the business for 20-some-odd years,
他想退出这行
and he was looking to get out.
斯坦自己说过他结交新朋友时
Sanderson: Stan himself says he was embarrassed to tell people,
羞于告诉别人他从事漫画业
when he met them, that he was working in comics.
这么多年来 他时常提起一个故事
And the way he tells it, and the way he’s told it for many years,
那就是他跟妻子琼的对话
is he had a conversation with his wife, Joan.
她告诉我
She said to me,
如果我想辞职
“if you want to quit,
在我那么做之前
before you do,
我为何不按照自己的心意创作一个故事？
why don’t you write one story the way you’d like to do it?”
你自己会想看的漫画
“The kind of comic books you would want to read yourself.”
这让他灵光一现
And that set off the light bulb.
不只是一个英雄
“Instead of just one hero,
我们来创作一群英雄的故事
let’s come up with a book with a team of heroes.”
我觉得按照我喜欢的方式创作
And I decided to do it the way I wanted to do it.
斯坦跟杰克·科比坐下来
So Stan sat down with Jack Kirby.
绳子绑不住神奇先生
杰克想出
Man: And Jack came up with
每个角色的人设结果他们创作出《神奇四侠》
the everyman designs of the characters, And they came up with the Fantastic Four.
走着瞧 姐妹神奇四侠才刚开始战斗
《神奇四侠》
《神奇四侠》是很特别的故事
Green: The Fantastic Four is a really special story.
那是关于一个因为疯狂特殊情形
It’s about a family that was kind of bonded together
而组成的家庭
by this insane, unique circumstance.
斯坦替超级英雄添加了现实层面
Stan added a level of realism to superheroes
那是前所未见的
that had never been seen before.
我尝试赋予每个角色不同的性格
Lee: I tried to give each one of them a separate personality.
故事一开始是这四个角色吵架斗嘴
Sanderson: It starts out with these four characters quarreling with each other.
宇宙放射线赋予他们超能力
These cosmic radiations that gave them super powers.
而且不是什么有用的超能力
Not, like, helpful powers, either.
而是古怪且复杂的超能力
Weird and kind of very complicated powers.
《神奇四侠》的早期作品
Brevoort: The earliest issues of Fantastic Four
其实看起来不像超级英雄漫画
actually do not look like superhero comics.
在《神奇四侠一号♥》中他们没有超级英雄的制♥服♥
Sanderson: They did not have superhero costumes in Fantastic Four #1.
石头人 神奇先生 火焰人
这些漫画
These comics
更吸引人令1961年的读者感到更震惊
were just more engaging and more electric to an audience in 1961.
漫威最受欢迎的角色
Man: One of the most popular characters Marvel had,
就是石头人 他也是个怪物
who was the Thing … was a monster.
我一直都很喜欢《科学怪人》这部电影
I always liked the movie “Frankenstein.”
我认为剧中的怪物是好人
To me, the monster was the good guy.
马丁当时出版的其他怪物作品
Brevoort: The other monster titles that Martin was publishing at the time
全都是像穿着橡胶服的巨型人形怪物
all had these big, almost man-in-a-rubber-suit monsters.
我心想若我能写出那种人物
Lee: I thought if I could write that type of guy
并让读者喜欢他
and make the reader like him,
我觉得那会是一番成就
I’d feel I had accomplished something.
所以他们创作的第二个角色是浩克
Brevoort: So, the second character that they did was the Hulk.
浩克也不是传统上的超级英雄
And the Hulk, too, is not really a traditional superhero.
而是关于变成怪物的那个人
It was more about the guy who transformed into the monster …
布鲁斯·班纳和他的矛盾
Bruce Banner … and his conflicts.
漫威漫画角色
Your Marvel comic book characters …
凯文·史密斯
漫威英雄的万神殿来自原子时代
the pantheon of Marvel heroes come from the atomic age.
三 二 一
Three… two… one…
与其专注在负面事物上我们何不从中发想创意
Rather than concentrate on the negativity, let’s make fantasy out of that.
想象存活下来并变成这个灰色巨人
Imagine you survived that and became this grey Goliath,
后来又变成了绿色
who will later be green,
因为灰浩克不太吸引人
because grey is not really an appealing color for the Hulk.
这种事情能引起人们的想象力
You know, things like that captured the imagination.
马丁说“这个挺成功的”
Martin said, “hey, these are doing well.
“再创造另一个超级英雄
”Come up with another superhero.”
我心想这个超级英雄要与众不同
I figured, “I want to make him different than all the others.”
把他塑造成青少年的形象会很有趣
It would be fun to make him a teenager.
我在思考时 看到墙壁上有一只苍蝇
And then, while I was thinking, I saw a fly on the wall,
我说“老天 如果超级英雄”
and I said, “gee, wouldn’t it be something
“能像昆虫一样黏在墙上该有多酷？
”if a superhero could stick to walls
你看那个在爬大楼的人
like an insect?”
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