佐杜洛夫斯基的沙丘（2013）

在我小时候 我和毕加索曾去过一个沙滩
“When we was young, myself and Picasso, we went to the beach.”
当我们打开车门的时候
And we open the door of the car…
在沙堆中 我们发现了一个计时器
“…always in the sand, we find a clock.”
计时器 你确定？
Clock, no?
你曾经在沙堆中发现过计时器吗？
“Do you find, in your life, a clock in the sand?”
我说到”我该回答你什么？”
And I say, “What I can answer?”
它走的很快 就像这样
It was very quick, like this, because…
因为12个人都在等着我提问
all the 12 person are awaiting my question.
如果我一直说我找到了计时器
Because if I say I find, all the time, clocks…
我将会成为一个非常虚荣的人 这很滑稽
I will be a vanity person. Ridiculous.
如果我说我没发现 我就会成为一个穷小子
If I say I never find a clock, I will be a poor guy.
我突然想到
And suddenly came to me, I say:
我从未发现过
“I never find a clock.
但是我丢失过很多
But I lost a lot.”
噢 真的吗
Really?
好 哈哈 “我在巴塞罗那等你”
“Okay!” And then, “I wait you in Barcelona!”
巴塞罗那
这只是一个游戏
It was a game.
佐杜洛夫斯基是超现实主义运动中的一员
Also, Jodorowsky was part of the surrealist movement…
达利喜欢这样
and Dali liked that.
所以这是他们之间的一个游戏
So it was a game between them.
谁会赢这场游戏呢
Who would win the game?
他和阿曼达·李尔一起经历了 他人生中的第一次冒险
He was going through his first adventure with Amanda Lear…
阿曼达·李尔是个非常性感的人
this sort of extraordinarily sexy person.
没人知道它到底是男是女
Nobody ever knew if it was a man or a woman…
这是个非常不可思议的角色
a completely incredible character.
她是启发创作的缪斯
A sort of muse, a poet’s muse.
将来见他 带着点暧昧*
Would come to see him, it was a bit ambiguous.
带着些许尊敬
There was a sort of respect.
当然 你的作品很成功
Yes, of course, you have success with your work…
但是我觉得他们还有点嫉妒
but there was also a little jealousy, I think.
他有点嫉妒
He was a bit jealous.
你不得不去见他和顺从他
And you had to meet him, you had to tame him…
他也被要求顺从你
and he needed to tame you.
然后他就会让你经历各个时期的启蒙
So he would make you go through these initiations each time.
当然 达利并不知道《沙丘》的真正用意
Of course, Dali had absolutely no idea what Dune was about.
他从来没看过这本书 不知道弗兰克·赫伯特是谁
He had never read the book. He didn’t know who Frank Herbert was.
哈哈 他并不知道《沙丘》到底在说什么
He didn’t know what Dune was talking about.
我必须给他点线索 因为我喜欢弗兰克·赫伯特和《沙丘》
So I had to clue him a little bit, because I liked Frank Herbert and I liked Dune.
我对他说”你知道吗 这是个非常伟大的事情”
And I said to him, “You know, this is a great thing.”
这并不仅仅是一部科幻小说 里面涵盖了很多哲学理论
It’s not just a science fiction. There’s a whole philosophy.”
他对这丝毫不感兴趣
He wasn’t interested in all that, I realized that.
她对我很好
She treated me very well…
变成了我的盟友
and she became an ally…
因为我答应让她演 伊露兰公主的角色
because I promised her the role of Princess lrulan.
伊露兰公主 皇帝
我认为这是让人异常兴奋的事情
Yes, I think that was hysterical.
因为达利说”对的 阿曼达必须演公主”
Because Dali said, “Yeah, and Amanda must play the princess.”
他们都看着我 “那么 她就是女主角？”哈哈
So they all look at me, “Well, is she an actress?”
“对的 这是自然 由她演公主”
“Oh, yes, of course. she’ll play the princess.”
她说”注意点 达利是非常会搞破坏的”
She said, “Be careful because Dali is destructive.”
如果他说”对”其实是代表 他会采取行动来破坏这电影
If he says ‘yes’, he is going to do everything to destroy the film.”
达利说”我可以要宜家直升飞机吗？”
Dali said, “Can I have a helicopter?”
对他而言 拥有一架直升飞机 已经是最好的条件了
To him, to have a helicopter was the maximum of, you know…
“可以可以 你可以有很多直升飞机”
“Yeah, yeah, you can have many helicopters.”
“我可以要个燃烧的长颈鹿吗”
“Can I have a burning giraffe?”
什么” 燃烧的 我要燃烧的”
“Well, what about…?” “Burning. I want burning.”
“当然 我们会有一个燃烧的长颈鹿”
“All right, we’ll have burning giraffe.
我们还会有大象 你想要的所有东西都会有
We’ll have elephants, whatever you want.”
着火的长颈鹿
渐渐的 你会发现 这部电影的预算越来越高
And slowly, you know, the budget of the movie was going up and up and up.
我们在谈论着成百上千上百万美元的事情
We’re talking hundreds of thousands, millions of dollars.
达利对我说”我会和你合作”
Dali say to me, “I will work with you…”
但是我想演男主角
but I want to be the actor…
好莱坞薪酬最高的男主角
Best paid actor in Hollywood.
一个小时十万美元
“I want $100,000 per hour.”
我回去后跟 亚历山德罗说 “我们永远也完成不了”
I went back and told Alejandro, “We’re never going to make it!”
我不能支付他”世界之最”
But I couldn’t pay him “the most in the world.”
这是不可能的
That would be impossible.
渐渐的
Then step by step…
我们是很固执的 因为 亚历山德罗告诉我们
because we were stubborn and because Alejandro would tell me…
达利是唯一一个能演君王的人
that Dali was the only one who could play the emperor…
一个极权主义的君王
the totalitarian emperor…
我们会告诉他
we had the idea of paying him…
一分钟的薪酬
by the minutes used.
我去见 亚历山德罗
I go to see Alejandro…
问他”电影里他有多少分钟的画面”
and ask, “How many minutes is he going to be filmed?”
“电影中他会出现多少分钟？”
How many minutes will he be in the movie?”
亚历山德罗说 “最多5分钟 也可能是3分钟”
Alejandro says, “Maximum five, probably three.”
然后我说”就这个办法”
So I said, “That’s the idea!”
我又去找达利说 “我会支付你每分钟十万美元的片酬”
I go back to see Dali and I say, “I will pay you $100,000 per minute!”
他说”太好了 我将成为一个一分钟 十万美元片酬的男主角”
He says, “That’s brilliant! I will be the $100,000 a minute actor!”
我会给你刻画一个人物形象 超现实主义的
I said, “I will take a mold of you, hyper-realistic…”
创造一个宇宙中的君王
and I will make the emperor of the galaxy…
他很怕死 他还有一个机器人 那个机器人也有人演
“…he is so afraid to be killed, he have a robot. And the robot will act.”
木偶皇帝扭头对着伊露兰公主
达利还说”如果你为我的博物馆 提供一个雕塑的话”
And Dali said, “Yes, if you give me the sculpture for my museum.”
“可以”就这样 我说服了达利
“Okay.” And then like this, I have Dali.
皇帝
在交流中 达利给了我一个吉格的目录册
And Dali, in our conversation, show me a catalog of Giger.
吉格
他跟我说 我觉得这人就是天才
And he say to me, “I think this person have a talent.”
我见识过 非常不可思议
I see that, I see… But is incredible!
这是我正在寻找的哈空能 那个坏男孩
Is what I am searching for the Harkonnen, for the bad guys.
哥特式的星球 哥特式的角色
The gothic planet, gothic characters.
然后我又开始去寻找吉格
And then I went to search Giger.
瑞士 格鲁耶尔
佐杜洛夫斯基和丹·奥班农 在巴黎看了我作品的展览
Paris was where Jodorowsky and Dan O’Bannon saw my work displayed…
《沙丘》美术师：H·R·吉格
希望我加入他们
and they wanted me to join them.
吉格 从来没拍过电影
Giger had never done movies.
我说”你必须会制♥作♥电影”
I said, “You have to make movies.”
这对我来说完全是陌生 并且超乎寻常的诱惑着我
It was completely new to me and incredibly fascinating.
我对吉格说 我需要你就跟你需要我一样
“I say to Giger, ” I need you as you are.
你在寻找着灵魂最深处的黑暗
You are searching in the deepest darkness of the soul.
这是不错的想法 也是属于你自己的艺术
And that is good. That is your art.
你的艺术对我来说是病态的
Your art is… For me, is an ill art.
这是很了不起的 病态的艺术 对哈空能男爵来说是很有必要的
“Marvelous, ill art, necessary for the Baron Harkonnen.”
哈空能男爵
我第一次见 佐杜洛夫斯基识在巴黎
I met Jodorowsky for the first time in Paris.
那个晚上
This was the evening when he attended…
他正要去参加一场马格马音乐会
a Magma concert.
哈空能星球里 我选择了巴黎
For the Harkonnen planet, I chose here in Paris…
马格马在当时是一个非常有名的乐队
a very famous group in that time, is Magma.
马格马是哥特式的
Magma was gothic, military…
非常适合战争的
terrible.
我对这个项目完全不了解
I knew nothing about the project, or the idea…
岩浆乐队：克里斯蒂安·万德
或者说*
or the book for that matter. I learned about all of that afterwards.
亚历山德罗在音乐上 没有给我们任何信息
Alejandro Jodorowsky didn’t give us any direction on the music.
我坚信他是信任我的
I believe he trusted us.
现在 他给我们描述了哈空能星球 我知道了
Now, I had an idea because he had described the planet, the Harkonnen.
我知道他们并不是真正的好孩子
I knew that they were not really the good guys…
他们更像是群坏孩子
that they were more like the bad guys.
所以想象起来很简单
So it was rather easy to imagine because…
马格马 在制♥作♥音乐的时候
Magma made music that was rather violent…
是很艰难的
typically hard, things like that.
我只是被这成果质量所惊讶到
I was just amazed by the quality…
我告诉他们当他被绑在十字架上的时候 我就好像是基♥督♥
and I told them I feltjust like Christ when he was on the cross.
我完全被音乐所感染吸引
I was fulfilled, it was fascinating, the music.
摇滚乐中 我用的是最好的音乐家
I was using the best musicians of this time, from rock.
菲德·劳沙
我想让米克·贾格尔演 费得·劳沙这个角色
I wanted Mick Jagger to play Feyd-Rautha, a character.
他烧死一只蝴蝶 然后长吸一口烟
我要怎么跟一个不被我有着 强大的电影制♥作♥能力
How am I going to contact this person…
所感染的人联♥系♥沟通
who is not going to be impressed that I have the great power to make a movie?