He said, “Wouldn’t it be wonderful
不是很好吗？”
if I could just keep doing this?”
因为，你知道，我们从来没见过
‘Cause, you know, we never see
成熟的人记录他的生活。
the mature man chronicling his life.
他说，”如果能在舞台上听到这种经历，那就太好了。
He says, “It’d be great to hear that experience on the stage,
而且真的，你知道，我的目标是成为一名长者。”
and really, you know, my goal is to become an elder.”
莱昂纳德在40岁时就在思考这些问题了
Leonard was thinking about those issues when he was 40
因为他正在探索他的犹太根源。
because he was exploring his Jewish roots.
而在犹太人的传统中，我认为
And in Jewish tradition, I think
你可以在40岁的时候开始学习卡巴拉（犹太教神秘主义体系）。
you could start studying Kabbalah when you’re 40.
你必须等到40岁才有那种生活经验
You have to wait till you’re 40 to have that life experience
才能够理解卡巴拉思想。
to be able to understand Kabbalistic thought.
科恩：我小时候在犹太教堂里
COHEN: I was so touched as a child
听到那种鼓动的演讲
by that kind of charged speech
感到很受触动
that I heard in the synagogue,
在那里一切都很重要。
where everything was important.
在我们的传统中，
The world was created through words,
世界是通过言语创造的。
through speech in our tradition.
BACAL。当我们年轻的时候，莱昂纳德会非常骄傲地说
BACAL: When we were young, Leonard would say very proudly
他的祖父可以拿一根针
that his grandfather could take a pin
把它穿过《摩西五经》
and put it through the Torah
并知道它所触及的每一页上的每一个字。
and know every word it touched on every page.
莱昂纳德-科恩曾经告诉一个采访者
Leonard Cohen once told an interviewer
他正在考虑改变他的名字。
that he was thinking of changing his name.
当你成为一个犹太名人时，你会改变你的名字。
When you’re a famous Jew, you change your name.
所以这就是问题所在，你不想太过犹太化
So that’s the deal is, you don’t want to be too Jewish
因为你会妨碍你的名声。
’cause you’ll get in the way of your fame.
采访者： 你有没有想过改变你的名字？
INTERVIEWER: Have you ever thought of changing your name?
是的，我打算把我的名字改为 “九月”。
Yeah, I was gonna change my name to September.
你说什么？
I beg your pardon?
我打算把我的名字改成九月
I was gonna change my name to September
当我开始写歌♥和唱歌♥的时候。
when I started writing songs and singing them.
莱昂纳德-九月？ 不，九月-科恩。
Leonard September?No, September Cohen.
哦。
Oh.
但科恩是个如此规整的姓氏
But Cohen is such a standard name.
是啊，九月也是很规整的。
Yeah, well, September is pretty standard too.
作为名字不是很规整
Not for a first name.
不，我想，呃…
No. Well, I thought that, uh…
你知道，我一直有这种感觉
You know, I always had this feeling
新的事物正在开始。
that new things are beginning.
我想我应该改变我的名字
And I thought that I would change my name
并做个纹身。
and get a tattoo.
九月是你对一个非犹太人说“埃卢月”的方式… …
September is how you say Elul to a non-Jew…
因为“埃卢月”是（希伯来语：）一年之始，赎罪日 之月。
’cause Elul is the month of Rosh Hashanah, Yom Kippur.
这是……这是最深的时刻
This is– This is the deepest time
当上帝在宝座上，而我们在下面。
when God’s on the throne and we’re down here,
我们带着破碎的心来到上帝面前
and we come to God with broken hearts
而上帝的仁慈治愈了我们。
and God’s mercies heal us.
所以我认为他想说…
So I think he wanted to say…
莱昂纳德-埃卢。
Leonard Elul.
你知道，莱昂纳德，这个人沉浸在
You know, Leonard, the man who’s immersed
沉浸在埃卢月的世界里。
in the world of the month of Elul.
当我在犹太教堂里站在我高大的叔叔们旁边时，
COHEN: When I was standing beside my tall uncles in the synagogue,
诵经者会列举出我们所有的
and the cantor would catalog all the various ways
罪孽和死亡的方式，这让我非常感动。
that we’ve sinned and died, that moved me very much.
当我父亲去世时，在他的葬礼之后。
When my father died, after his funeral,
我发现自己写了一些话给他。
I found myself writing some words to him.
然后我拿起他的一条正式领带
Then I took one of his formal ties
我用刀片把它割开。
and I slit it open with a razor blade,
我把这个小纸条，这首小诗放在领带里。
and I put this little note, this little poem into the tie,
然后我把它埋在花♥园♥里。
and I buried it in the garden.
我想这是我第一次
I think that was the first time
以一种神圣的方式使用语言。
I ever used language in a sacramental way.
揭开生命的神秘面纱是他的主要关注点。
Unlocking the mysteries of life was his primary preoccupation.
所以，如果你有任何类似的问题，
So if you had any questions along those lines,
他是……他是一个可以交谈的人。
he was– He was the guy to talk to.
罗宾逊：我曾在洛杉矶工作过
ROBINSON: I had been working in Los Angeles
作为一名临时歌♥手。
as a session singer,
然后莱昂纳德邀请我加入他们的巡演
and then Leonard invited me to go on the road with them
参加 “野战司令科恩 “巡演。
for the Field Commander Cohen tour.
我是詹妮弗-沃内斯的另一位歌♥手。
I was the other singer with Jennifer Warnes.
我当时，你知道，非常，非常年轻。
I was, you know, very, very young.
但是我一进来就感受到了莱昂纳德的温暖。
But I came in and felt an immediate warmth from Leonard.
所以我们花了很多时间
So we spent a lot of time
谈论他的整体人生哲学。
talking about his overall philosophy of life.
他置身于全世界的受苦者之中
He was very attuned to human suffering around the world,
尽管他有舒适的生活
even though he was relatively comfortable in life.
他一直关注
And he was constantly aware
那些没有舒适生活的人。
of everyone in the world who isn’t comfortable.
科恩：当你看到这个世界，看到那些法则
COHEN: When you see the world and you see the laws
那些具有残酷必然性的支配法则
of brute necessity which govern it,
你会意识到，只有一种方法
you realize that the only way
可以调和这痛苦的面纱
that you can reconcile this veil of suffering,
使它与理智和解，你只有
the only way you can reconcile it to sanity
把灵魂附身在祈祷者身上。
is to glue your soul to prayer.
他真的在寻找他的道路。
He was really on a quest to find his path,
他的精神之路，他尝试了无数的东西。
his spiritual path, and he tried a million things.
科恩：嗯，我一直在学习
COHEN: Well, I’ve been studying
我跟一位日本老先生学习了很多年。
with an old Japanese gentleman for many years.
罗宾逊：武天在欧洲有一个禅宗中心。
ROBINSON: Roshi had a Zen center over in Europe,
所以他出来和我们一起坐车。
so he came out and he rode with us on the bus.
科恩：在我自己的文化和训练中
COHEN: There were a lot of wonderful things
有很多美妙的东西
in my own culture, my own training,
但在我的意识背后
but always in the back of my mind
始终有某种共鸣存在与我心里
was some kind of resonating presence in my heart.
我感觉到有一些东西可以被治愈。
Some sense that there was something that could be healed.
我记得有一次我在思考炼狱的问题。
I remember once I was musing on purgatory,
我对它感到恐惧。
and I was fearful of it.
他说。
And he said:
这就是炼狱。
This is purgatory.
他指的是整个场景。
And he meant the whole scene,
我们所生活的一切。
what we’re living.
同时，他还会说
And at the same time, he would say
这是一个多么神奇的实验。
what an amazing experiment this is.
我们当时非常年轻。
We were very young then.
即使在那时，那是有关社区的破裂
Even then, it was about the brokenness
而我们都来自于那个社区
of the community that we both had come out of.
他们有很多规则。
They had a lot of rules.
你去上学，你结婚。
You went to school, you got married.
你有孩子，你住在威斯敏特的一个好房♥子里。
You had children, you lived in a nice house in Westmount.
那是为我们写的。
That was written for us.
这首歌♥是根据我在蒙特利尔Westmount高中的
This is a song based on my extremely boring
极其无聊和可悲的生活写的。
and pathetic life at Westmount High School in Montreal,
这是我几年前写的一首歌♥
and it’s a song that I wrote a couple of years ago
和菲尔-斯派克特一起写的。
with Phil Spector.
我一直听说莱昂纳德
LISSAUER: I’d been hearing that Leonard
要和菲尔-斯派克特一起录音。
was going to record with Phil Spector.
莱昂纳德与菲尔-斯派克特的经历……。
SLOMAN: Leonard’s experience with Phil Spector…
整个故事，我想，是因为马蒂-马查特。
That whole thing, I think, was Marty Machat,
他当时是莱昂纳德的经纪人，也是菲尔的经纪人。
who was Leonard’s manager at the time, also managed Phil.
所以他把他们放在一起。
So he put them together.
LISSAUER：我一直有种感觉，马蒂不喜欢我。
LISSAUER: I always got the sense that Marty didn’t like me,
我当时太年轻了，这是我感觉到的东西。
I was too young, it was something I just sensed.
也许马蒂不喜欢我的头发。
Maybe Marty didn’t like my hair.
所以当斯佩克特出现的时候，他是一个传奇的制♥作♥人。
And so when Spector came along, he was a legendary producer,
他可能是世界上最有名的制♥作♥人。
he might have been the most famous producer in the world.
他是唱片制♥作♥人里的明星。
It was record producer as star.
所以我说，”孩子，我想他们找到大佬。”
So I said, “Boy, I guess they got the real guy.”
这孩子做的足够多了。
Enough work with this kid,
我们会得到真正的流行音乐人。”
we’re gonna get the real pop ringer.”
克拉克森：你对这张专辑的感觉如何？
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