COLLINS: So I came back with him,
然后我们一起完成了《苏珊娜》。
and then we finished “Suzanne” together.
观众很宽容。我只是太紧张了。
COHEN: The audience was generous. It was just nerves.
那是第一次，在那之后，你知道。
So that was the first time, and after that, you know,
他因其声线和自写自演而闻名。
he became known for his voice and singing his own songs.
哈蒙：准备。第二遍，好的。
HAMMOND: Standby. Take 2.MAN: Okay.
等一下。
HAMMOND: Just a sec.
我觉得你开始得有点慢，莱昂纳德。
I think you’re starting a little slow, Leonard.
对。哈蒙：请准备。
COHEN: Right.HAMMOND: Standby, please.
我有个朋友说。
There was a friend of mine that said,
约翰，有一个加拿大诗人。
John, there’s this poet from Canada,
他是个出色的作曲家，但他不识谱。
he’s a wonderful songwriter, but he doesn’t read music,
他是个非常奇怪的人。
and he’s sort of very strange.
我不认为哥伦比亚（唱片公♥司♥）会对他感兴趣。
I don’t think Columbia would be at all interested in him,
但你可能会感兴趣。”
but you might be.”
所以我听了他的demo，然后…
So I listened to this guy and…
看吧，我觉得他很有魅力。
Lo and behold, I thought he was enchanting.
约翰-哈蒙德带着莱昂纳德-科恩来见我…
John Hammond brought Leonard Cohen to see me and…
我确实记得那次会面。
I do remember that meeting.
也许是共同的犹太血统，总之我和他建立了联♥系♥
Maybe it’s our common Jewish ancestry, but I related to him.
约翰说，”莱昂纳德是一个原创者。”
And John said, “Leonard is an original.”
哈蒙：第四遍。
HAMMOND: Take four.
他是一个诗人，他自有其独特的风格
DAVIS: That he’s a poet and that he will make his own way
这在他身上是不可替代的
in a special way that’s unique to him.
哈蒙：请稍等。莱昂纳德，对不起。这已经超过20秒了。
HAMMOND: Just a sec. Leonard, excuse me. That’s over 20 seconds.
我不认为前奏应该…..
I don’t think the introduction should be more…
不，我没想拖那么长。
COHEN: No, I wasn’t thinking of it that long.
我只是想在我开始唱歌♥之前进入状态。
I just want to get into it before I started singing.
我没准备好，在一个前奏中。
I didn’t have it, in terms of an introduction.
哈蒙：第五遍。
HAMMOND: Take five.
他是莱昂纳德-科恩。没人模仿他。
He was Leonard Cohen. No one walked in his path.
他也没有模仿别人。
He didn’t walk in anybody else’s path.
非常棒，莱昂纳德。你想听一下吗？
HAMMOND: Bravo, Leonard. Would you like to listen to it?
科恩：是的。
COHEN: Yeah.
人们总是告诉我。
COHEN: People are always telling me:
你为什么不录一些前两张唱片那样的东西？
Why don’t you do something like you did two records ago?
我只是不想重复自己。
I just don’t want to repeat myself.
对我来说，唯一真正令人兴奋的
To me, the only really exciting thing
就是找到新的形式。
about the work is finding new forms.
所以我将继续努力寻找新的形式。
So I will keep on trying to find new forms.
LISSAUER：我在蒙特利尔遇到了莱昂纳德
LISSAUER: I met Leonard in Montreal…
1972年。
in 1972.
我当时在蒙特利尔的纳尔逊酒店演出。
I was performing in Montreal at the Hotel Nelson,
那就像一场盛事。
and it was like a happening.
城里所有人都去了那儿，简直挤爆了。
Everyone in town was there. The place was exploding.
我们在那呆了一周，票都卖♥♥光了。
We were there for a week, and it was sold out.
他们在外面排着队。
They were lined up around outside.
这个安静的家伙走过来
And this quiet guy comes over
穿着黑色西装，站在那里。
in a black suit and stands there,
一只手插在口袋里。
one hand in his pocket.
我们开始交谈，他大加褒扬
We started talking, he was very complimentary
称赞音乐是多么令人兴奋。
about how exciting the music was.
问我是否有兴趣
Would I be interested
和他谈谈录音的事
in talking with him about recording?
我说，”我要回我在纽约的家了”。
I said, “I’m heading back to my place in New York.”
好吧，我就来。
Well, I’ll come down.
我当时22岁？
I was 22?
我当时默默无闻。
I was unknown.
但我们一拍即合。
But we hit it off.
他给我演奏了一些伟大的歌♥曲。
And he played me some great songs.
我立刻感觉到这些歌♥不一样。
And immediately I sensed that these songs were different.
莱昂纳德的歌♥对我来说有电影般的感觉。
Leonard’s songs felt cinematic to me.
我马上说：
LISSAUER: And right away, I said:
天啊，我们可以录下来，然后把它们放在
Boy, we could record these and sort of drape them
一个梦里，就像每首歌♥都是生活的一个小插曲”。
in a dream, like every one is a vignette of life.”
他有点喜欢这个想法，所以在几个月内，
And he sort of liked that idea, so within a couple of months,
我们录制了，我猜是八到九首歌♥。
we recorded, I guess it was eight or nine songs.
LISSAUER：这是《旧仪式的新貌》。
LISSAUER: This wasNew Skin for the Old Ceremony.
这是我和Leonard做的第一件事。
It was the first thing that I did with Leonard.
科恩：就这张唱片的实际音乐风格而言。
COHEN: In terms of the actual musical style of the record,
很大程度上要归功于John Lissauer。
a great deal of it is due to John Lissauer.
他是一个非常年轻的人
He’s a very young man
有着多年来我所遇到的…
and certainly the most interesting musical mind
最有趣的音乐思想。
that I’ve come across in many years.
LISSAUER：我们完成了这张唱片
LISSAUER: We finished the record
组了一个乐队开始巡演。
and put together a band and went on tour.
那是一个小乐队，只有我们五个人。
It was a small band, just the five of us.
我们去了很多城市。
And we did a lot of cities.
我们走遍了整个欧洲。
We did all of Europe.
然后，在我们巡演了大约9个月之后，
And then, after we toured for about nine months or so,
莱昂纳德问我，有没有兴趣和他合写…
Leonard asked me if maybe I’d like to co-write
一张专辑。
an album with him.
我说，”你想怎么做？
I said, “How do you want to do it?
你想要我们坐在一起
You want to sit around together,
还是你想让我把你的诗句
or do you want me to take your poetry
变成音乐？”
and essentially set them to music?”
他说，”好吧，我们开始吧。”
And he said, “Well, let’s do that.”
他说，”我将在洛杉矶待上几个星期。
And he said, “I’m gonna be in L.A. for a couple of weeks.
你不如来加入我？
Why don’t you come join me?
我们去马蒙特城♥堡♥。
We’ll go to the Chateau Marmont,
找几个房♥间，然后写作。”
get a couple of rooms and write.”
于是我飞到那里，他在房♥间里有一架钢琴。
LISSAUER: So I flew out there, and he had a piano in the room.
我们写出了六首歌♥。
We came up with six songs.
这就是那张《给丽贝卡的歌♥》
It was gonna be an album calledSongs for Rebecca.
这很让人激动。
It was thrilling.
我们用粗哑的声线唱所有的歌♥
We had rough vocals on everything
为所有的歌♥编曲
and arrangements on everything.
它看起来相当好。
It was in pretty good shape.
然后他说，”好吧，我要去海德拉
And he said, “All right, I’m going to go to Hydra
几个星期。
for a couple of weeks.
我正在写一本诗集，这个那个… …
I’m working on a book of poetry, this and that…
我回来后会给你打电♥话♥，我们来收尾。”
I’ll call you when I get back, and we’ll finish up.”
然后我就再也没有听到他的消息…
And I didn’t hear from him…
八年了。
for eight years.
喂？ 莱昂纳德？
COHEN: Hello?SLOMAN: Leonard?
是的，你好，我是拉里-斯洛曼。
COHEN: Yeah. Hi, this is Larry Sloman.
74年，我是《滚石》杂♥志♥的一名年轻记者。
I was a young reporter for Rolling Stone Magazine in ’74,
我得到了一个重要的任务，写一篇关于莱昂纳德的文章。
and I got the plum assignment of doing a piece on Leonard.
莱昂纳德？是的。
Leonard? Yeah.
你的日程安排是怎样的？
What’s your schedule gonna be like?
让我们约定好
COHEN: Let’s make a definite appointment
明天早上。
for tomorrow morning.
你是早起，还是……？
Do you get up early, or do you…?
斯洛曼：不，我通常睡得很晚。
SLOMAN: No, I usually sleep pretty late.
我告诉你吧，我今天可能会呆在皇后区
I’ll tell you what, I’ll probably stay in Queens today
因为我的音响在我父母的房♥子里。
’cause I have my stereo out at my parents’ house.
我给你打电♥话♥还是…？
COHEN: Shall I call you or…?
SLOMAN：我没有电♥话♥。
SLOMAN: I don’t have a phone.
告诉我你什么时候起床。
COHEN: Tell me what time you get up.
通常11点左右。
SLOMAN: I usually get up around 11.
我差不多那个时段会到城里。
So I’ll probably get into the city around,
那么说，明天1点左右
let’s say, 1:00 tomorrow.
COHEN：好的，到时候见。好的。
COHEN: Okay, I’ll see you then. Good.
我几乎成了一个痴迷者。
SLOMAN: I became almost like an obsessive.
我是说，我真的跟踪了他三天。
I mean, I literally stalked him for three days.
在第一场晚上的演出之后
And after the first night of the first show,
回到了他的酒店房♥间。
went back to his hotel room,
就一直向他提问，问了两个小时。
just kept peppering him with questions for two hours,
而他是如此亲切。
and he was so gracious.
我想他当时是40岁。
He was, I think, 40 at the time.
他说，”如果我能继续做下去，
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