第四公民

有可能他们会采取比较不理智的方法
They are probably not gonna be particularly rational in their part
但是同时我也觉得
but at the same time there’s
政♥府♥目前所有的行为都是受到限制的
I do think they are limited for the moment
我同意你的看法 我觉得应该要让
I, I agree and I mean I had kind of time
事情发展到能给我们提供
to set a stage where
起码的保护的地步
we all enjoy at least a minimum level of protection
不管我们的身份
you know no matter who we are
不管我们是不是参与到这件事情中
who’s involved in this you know
不管是不是记者
you’re either a journalist
对
Right.
不管是不是在这个范围之内
or you’re either out of jurisdiction
所以在政♥府♥开始有所行动之前
so we have some time to play this
我们还有时间
before they can really investigate
等他们的律师做好准备
I think it’s over you know the weeks
大概需要几个星期的时间
when they have time to get lawyers really sort to go
情况太特殊了 对接下来的事情我们要怎么预测
This is a special situation how can we interpret this tour in advance
根据19世纪40年代的法律
like we see them do this all the time you know
不管是无人机 窃听装置 还是其他的手段
whether it’s drones or wiretapping whatever the go
他们就一直在我们眼皮子底下进行信息收集
while according to this law from the 1840s
政♥府♥的所作所为虽然也能得到解释
and we can actually explain why there is this authority
但是要让一切都被接受还是需要时间
But that takes time
以及民众的同意
and that takes agreement
对 我认为他们一切行动都在明处
Yeah, you know, I mean, I think they are public
作为记者
we are out there to, as journalists
我们可能可以得到更多的保护
the more protection that’s gonna give us as well
你决定好什么时候
Have you started to give thought
亮明身份了吗
to when you are ready to come forward
什么时候都可以
I’m, I’m ready whenever
我觉得大家都同意
honestly I think there’s sort of agreement
新闻报道中心不能走偏
that is not going to bias the reporting process
这是我目前最担心的
that’s my primary concern at this point
对于即将发生的事情
I don’t want to give myself into the issue of
我不想让自己成为中心
what’s gonna happening anyway and
这会把注意力从他们发表的报道上
where it takes away from stories
都转移到我身上
they are getting out
我们现在的话题是成千上万的美国公民
We are talking about tens of millions of Americans
即使没有犯罪的嫌疑
who weren’t suspected in doing anything
也正在以这种方式被监控着
who were surveilled in this way
大家想一想
Here are thoughts for a moment
我想继续讨论这个话题
I’d like to continue this conversation
这些是非常重要非常敏感的事情
There are really important sensitive issues
公众有权利知道事情的真♥相♥
the public out there has a right to know
有权知道到底发生了什么
what’s going on standby
现在是CNN最新新闻
This is CNN Breaking News.
又一爆♥炸♥性新闻
Another explosive article has just appeared this time
刊登在了华♥盛♥顿♥邮♥报♥最新新闻的板块上
in the Washington Post on its Breaking News
揭示了美国政♥府♥
it reveals another broad and secret
另一监视计划
US government surveillance program.
美国华♥盛♥顿♥邮♥报♥和英国卫报
The Washington Post and Guardian in London
报道了美国国♥家♥安♥全♥局和美国联邦调查局
reporting that the NSA and the FBI
直接进入美国九大网络公♥司♥的中心服务器
are tapping directly into the central servers
搜集数据
of nine leading internet companies
包括微软 雅虎 谷歌♥ 脸书
including Microsoft, Yahoo, Google, Facebook
美国在线 Skype YouTube和苹果
AOL, Skype, YouTube and Apple
华♥盛♥顿♥邮♥报♥称他们搜集语♥音♥ 视频
The Post says they are extracting audio, video
照片 电子邮件 文件和连接日志
photographs, emails, documents
根据这些 分♥析♥员可以掌握
and connection logs that enable analysts
一个人的行踪
to track a person’s movements
以及社交情况
and contacts over time
接下来我们将就最新的报道进行讨论
Let’s discuss this latest revelation
这一报道的进展速度很快
that coming out fast
宾尼是2001年辞职的前国♥家♥安♥全♥局官员
go Binney, the former official of NSA
你先来谈谈吧
who quit back in 2001
以前你对国♥家♥安♥全♥局的所作所为感到不满
you were anger of what was going on
一直以来 你也被称作告密者
you’ve been known as whistleblower right now
你是怎样看待华♥盛♥顿♥邮♥报♥所披露的事件的
Though what do you think about this Washington Post story?
我认为这是
Well I assume it’s just the continuation
国♥家♥安♥全♥局一直以来的监视计划的延续而已
of what they’ve been doing all along.
所以你一点也不吃惊
So you are not surprised
是的
Not at all.
你知道是谁泄露这些消息的吗
Do you have any ideas of who’s leaking this information
我不知道是谁泄露的
I don’t know who leaked this
但是我确信
but I have no doubt that
他们并不会去调查
the administration will launch an investigation
是谁批准了这些计划
not into who approve these programs
还是去调查是谁泄露了秘密
but into who leaked the information.
这些公♥司♥矢口否认我对此不感到吃惊
I’m not shocked the companies deny it yet
我并不是说…
I don’t assume….
他是在谴责这件事
He blamed it
他们可以用一些技术问题当做借口
There maybe some technical bases
说他们不是主动收集资料
on which they can say that we are not actively collaborating or
我们认为的”直接进入服务器”
they don’t have what we consider in narrow definition
跟他们想的不一样
to be direct access to our servers
但是我能肯定的是
But I do know is that
因为我跟很多人谈过
I’ve talked to more than one person
他们坐在办公桌前
who has sat at a desk
进入一个门户网站 输入命令之后
added a web portal and typed out commands
就能远程进入服务器
and reached into those servers from the distance
所以 无论他们怎么说
so whatever they wanna call that
这就是事实
that’s what happening.
我觉得它是到目前为止
What, What I will call it is the single biggest infringement
对美国公民自♥由♥权利的最大的侵犯 是吧
on American civil liberties probably all-time, isn’t it
今天 政客们都已经拿到了纽♥约♥时♥报♥
Politicians already have the New York Time now today
报纸上说
saying the administration
奥巴马政♥府♥已经失去了所有公信力
has lost all credibility
对 纽♥约♥时♥报♥就用这件事
Yeah, the New York Time slammed
猛喷奥巴马总统
President Obama for this
老实说 我已经对此见怪不怪了
Frankly I was used to that
纽♥约♥时♥报♥也因为小布♥什♥
The New York Time just slammed George Bush
做的保护国家政策喷过他
for protecting the country for the steps he took
我不想放松警惕
I don’t wanna start to drop our guard
我也不想让大家再上当受骗
I don’t want us to be stuck again
和我们在波士顿看到的一样 安德森
As we saw in Boston, Anderson
人们很乐意牺牲自己的自♥由♥
people are willing to sacrifice their civil liberties,
他们住在自己的房♥子里因为他们没有…
people sheltered inside ’cause they’re not…
现在还怎么相信自♥由♥ 你说
How can you believe in freedom, do you think
让我来说几句大实话
I mean, try play the devil’s advocate for me
一个国家有秘密法庭
When you have secret courts,
秘密操作的东西 比如说监狱 秘密调查
secret operations like prison, secret investigations
对每个美国人的通话都进行监控
which is going to ever… call for every America’s live
但是美国公民对此却一无所知
without any member of the American public knowing about it
这还是自♥由♥吗
that’s not freedom, isn’t it
在2008年 政♥府♥决定
In 2008 they eliminated the warrant requirement
除了他们在美国收买♥♥美国人
for all conversations
协助监听活动的对话外
expect one that takes place
民众对话的监听
buying among the Americans
不需要获得批准
exclusively on the American soil
所以现在对在国外的外国人
So they don’t need warrants now for people
监听他们更不需要许可了
who are foreigners outside the US
但是现在就算是在美国的美国人
but they also don’t need warrants for Americans
只要和他们认为是在国外的人进行通讯
in the United States communicating with people
他们也可以不经过许可就监听通讯
reasonably believed to be outside of the US.
所以事实就是
So again the fact they are no checks,
国♥家♥安♥全♥局不受任何审查或监督
no oversight about who’s looking over the NSA shoulder
这就意味着他们私底下
means they can take whatever they want
想拿什么就拿什么
and in fact that it was behind the wall of secrecy
他们还威胁想要曝光他们人
and they threaten people who want to expose it
他们现在不管做什么
means that whatever they are doing
就算是违法行为
even violating the law
我们也不知道
is something that we unlikely to know