第四公民

除非我们对政♥府♥行为
until we start having real investigations
进行真正的调查
and real transparency into
要求透明公开
what it is the government is doing.
格伦 格林沃德
Glenn Greenwald
再一次恭喜你揭露了这一丑闻
congratulations again on exposing what is a truth scandal
谢谢你的报道
Appreciate you enjoying me
她还活着这简直太好了
and she’s still alive which is good
我的房♥租支票显然
and for my rent checks apparently
没有再到我的房♥东手里
are no longer getting through to my landlord
所以他们警告说5天之内不交房♥租
so they said if we don’t pay them in five days
我们就会被赶出去
we’ll be evicted
这太奇怪了
which is strange
因为我们设置了一个系统
because we’ve got a system set up
会自动打钱给他们
to automatically pay them
然后我家门外的街上
So this then, apparently these construction trucks
都是工程车
are all over the street over my house
我想知道他们在找什么
I wonder what they are looking for
这种感觉是很奇怪的
It is, it is an unusual… kinda hard to
难以用语言来表达
hard like to describe or convey words
一个人不知道接下来的一个小时
but not knowing what’s gonna happen in the next day
一天甚至一个星期之内会发生什么
the next hour, the next week
这让人很害怕
It’s scary
但同时我也觉得松了口气
but at the same time it’s liberating
你知道 相比之下
You know
有计划 事情就会容易的多
The planning comes a lot easier
因为没有很多变数
because you don’t have that many variables taken into play
你只能一遍一遍照着做
you can only act and then act again
现在所有的通话都有电子记录
Now all these phone calls
但不是记录谈话内容
are being recorded digitally not for content
而是为了记录呼叫人和被呼叫人
but for origin and destination
警告 现在政♥府♥可以直接进入
now warm the government is going right
大型网络公♥司♥服务器
into the servers of these large internet companies
政♥府♥的理由是为了国♥家♥安♥全♥
How does the government politically speaking
而不是对个人隐私的侵犯
make the argument that this is essential to national security
他们是怎么解释的呢
and not a dramatic overreach in terms of personal privacy
马特 政♥府♥要进行解释真的很困难
It’s difficult, Matt
正如昨晚皮特所说
because as Peter was pointing out last night
一切即将真♥相♥大白
we had an extraordinary late night close to midnight
国家情报局局长发表了公告 实施解密
announcement and declassification from the director of National Intelligence
他们现在一片混乱
they are scrambling
政♥府♥已经获得了
the administrations are already supported strongly
情报委员会两大党派领导人的极力支持
by leaders in both parties from the Intelligence Committees
英国政♥府♥通信总部自己的机密文件都有内部文件百科
GCHQ has an internal Wikipedia at the top secret you know,
都是非常机密的文件
super classified level
任何在国家情报局工作的人
where anybody working in Intelligence
都可以得到任何他们想要的信息
can work on anything they want
记住了
Yeah
就是这个 我把它给你
That’s what it is. I’m giving it to you.
你来做决定
You can make the decisions on that
什么该公布
what’s appropriate, what’s not.
这些都是不同形式的资料
It’s gonna be documents of a few of different types,
比如照片 幻灯片和文件 类似这些
pictures, power points or documents, stuff like that
我能坐吗
So can I take that seat
当然
Yeah
所以这些资料内容是…
So these documents they will show…..
文件百科里的资料更多
Yeah, there will be a couple of more documents on that
现在这些只是一部分
That’s only one part though
都是有关《TEMPRO》和一些别的东西
like talks about TEMPOR and a little more thing
但是文件百科里
that’s the Wiki articles itself
还介绍了他们自己研发的UDAQ工具
It was also talking about a self-developed tool called UDAQ, U-D-A-Q
用来搜索他们收集的资料
It’s their search tool for all the stuff they collected was what it looks like
里面还有很多有关计划项目
It’s gonna be projects,
特殊工具故障维修的资料
it’s gonna be trouble-shooting pages for particular tool
谢谢
Thanks
你觉得你什么时候会亮明身份
When do you think you will be public?
很快
I think it’s pretty soon
我出现带来的影响
I mean, with the reaction
肯定会加速事态的发展
it’s escalating more quickly
只要他们开始拿我作文章
I think pretty much as soon as
我就会现身
they start trying to make this about me
应该很快了
which should be any day now
是
Yeah
我会亮明身份
I’ll come out, just go, hey, you know,
这件事不是说一个人
this is, this is not a question of somebody
藏在暗处偷偷摸摸地做事
skulking around in the shadows
这些事事关公众
These are public issues
并不是我一个人的事
these are not my issues, you know
这是每个人的事
these are everybody’s issues
我不怕他们
and I’m not afraid of you, you know
他们可以把别人打到闭嘴
you are not gonna bulling me into silence
在我身上没用
like you’ve done to everybody else.
如果这件事没有人做
And if nobody else gonna do it
那么我会挺身而出
I will
希望死了我这个夏明翰
and hopefully when I’m gone
后面还有后来人
whatever you do to me there will be somebody
会做跟我同样的事
else will do the same thing
就像九头蛇网络法则一样
It will be the sort of internet principle of Hydra.
一个人被阻止了
You know you can stop one person
会有七个人再站出来
but it’s gonna be seven more of us.
是的
Yeah.
你是不是觉得越来越紧张了
Are you getting more nervous
没有 主要是我看待压力的方式
Uh, I mean, no, I, I think the way I look at stress
我知道会发生什么事
particularly because I sort of knew this was coming
这些事都是我自愿的
you know, because I, sort of, volunteered to walk into it
我已经很习惯这些想法了
I’m already sort of familiar with the idea
我不担心
I’m not worried about
如果有人突然破门而入
when somebody like, busts the door
那瞬间我是会受到影响 感到紧张
suddenly I’ll get nervous and a little effected
但是其实我真的不紧张
but I totally do, you know
我想我唯一的变化就是
I’m eating a little less that’s the only
吃的比以前少了
the only difference I think.
我们来讨论一下
Let’s talk about the issue
什么时候公布你的身份
with when we’re gonna say who you are
好
yeah
我们必须要好好谈谈
This is you know, you have to talk me through this
因为我很担心
because I have a big worry about this
好 说吧
ok, tell me
我担心 如果我们说出了你的身份
which is that if we come out
我知道你认为他们找到你是肯定的
and I know that you believe that your detection is inevitable
这也是早晚的事
and it’s inevitable imminently
今天纽♥约♥时♥报♥的查理·萨维奇
There’s you know in the New York Times today Charlie Savage
报道得跟福尔摩斯一样很吸引人
the fascinating Sherlock Holmes like of reporting
他说自从奥巴马上台后
did use that fact that
就有很多人开始泄密
there’s been these leaks since succession
这意味着有人想要爆料爆的越多…
probably means there’s some one person who’s decided to leak as much as
有的人通过成为你的读者来支持你
someone else supported you as saying I was one of your readers
是
Yeah
有的人则做事实
somebody else who put a lot of things
我想说的是 这没关系
I mean it’s fine
我想让别人
I want people, I want be like, you know like
我想介绍你的时候
This is the person I want to start introducing the concept that
告诉他们你的目标是
this is a person who has a particular set of political objective
告诉世界
about informing the world
发生的一切
of what is taking place
我现在都没有亮明你的身份
you know, I didn’t show
我写你都是匿名的
I’m keeping it all anonymous, totally
但是我想以一种相比之下
But I wanna to start introducing you
比较高调的方式介绍你
in that kind of incremental way
问题是
but here’s, here’s the thing
我担心我们把你身份公开以后
what I’m concerned about is that we come out and say