国家美术馆（2014）

好的 -所以这应该是一面墙壁
OK.- So this would be one wall.
好的 我知道了 -所以它是在 在那块儿空间内
Right, I get it.- So it’s within that… Within that space.
所以它不是很大
So it’s not a very big…
你要离绘画多远
And how far do you have to be from the paintings?
那会是什么 -障碍物 那里 -障碍物
What would be the…- The barrier, there.- The barrier.
那只是个屏障物 那用什么做障碍物
That’s just the barrier. And what is the barrier?
可以准备好链钩 但是那可能会像一个
It can be up for grabs, but it would be like a…
可能像一个绳状物
Probably like a rope thing.
我觉得很好 就空间来说
I think it’s fine, space-wise.
这个不是问题 地板怎样设计 -额
I don’t think it’s a problem. What’s the floor like?- Um…
用混凝土 最上面会用木材
It is concrete with wood over the top,
或许你可以加一些乙烯基或其他什么东西
but maybe you could put some vinyl or something?
好 是这样的 实际上 -我们看一看地板好吗
Well..- It’s this, actually.- Shall we just have a look at the floor?
混凝土在下面 这是橡木的 铺在混凝土上
It’s concrete underneath. It’s oak, I think, over concrete.
我的意思是 我觉得我们必须着眼于 在提香作品前 我们想要
I mean, I think we just have to look at what we want
达到的视觉审美效果
the visual aesthetic thing to be, in front of the Titians.
我觉得如果放一块地板介入其中
I just think if you put a floor intervention on there,
可能看起来会有点假
it might look a little bit artificial.
而且实际上 我是说 如果有个叫艾德的人
And actually… I mean, if it was an Ed person,
你可以问他是否愿意在上面跳舞 作为一个问题 或者卡洛斯
you could ask him if he would dance on that, as a question. Or Carlos.
就当作一个问题 -你介意 -在上面跳舞吗
You know, as a question – would you mind…?- Dancing on that?
好的 他们会形成一种观点且开启另一种视角
Yeah, and they would have a point of view and one more perspective.
所以我认为问题还是得问 -是的 好
So I think the question would have to be asked.- Yeah, OK.
我觉得这没问题 因为并不是说
I don’t think it will be a problem, because it’s not like
他们要做巨大的跳跃 -甚至卡洛斯
they’re going to be doing massive jumps and leaps…- Even Carlos.
不是在这儿 不 卡洛斯也不必
Not in here, no. Not even Carlos.
但是我想 链条没什么用
But I think…a line is no use.
没有用吗 所以你得设一块装有弹簧的地板 然后
It’s no use?- So you’d have to build a floor which is sprung, and then
变成一个整体 -那会 -有点太有活力了
you get into a whole other…- That would be…- ..kind of dynamic.
我觉得 来到一个美术馆在提香作品前跳舞
I think, coming into a gallery to dance in front of the Titians –
那是这次活动得的本质
that’s what the nature of the event is,
所以人们必须找到最合适的事情 -好的
so one has to find what would be the most appropriate thing.- OK.
大家早上好
So, good morning everybody
非常感谢今早的到来
and thank you so much for coming this morning.
提香给这些作品以特殊的称谓
Titian called these works something special –
他称它们为诗 诗
he called them “poems” – “poesie” –
那是首次有艺术家提及自己的作品
and that was the first time that an artist had referred to his works
以他本身与诗人的诗歌♥天赋
in a way comparing himself to…
相比较的方式
..the intellectual capacity of poets –
古代诗人
poets of the ancient times.
当然 提香最喜欢的诗人
And of course, Titian’s favourite poet,
他非常熟悉并且能读懂
who he was very familiar with and was able to read
在那个时代有许多
in the many wonderful vernacular translations
许多优秀直译作品流通的诗人
that were circulating that time,
他 当然 是位古罗马诗人
who, of course, was a Roman poet
著名的变形记就是他写的
and who wrote the wonderful Metamorphoses.
奥维德写了关于古希腊众神庙里一些神的传说
Ovid told these tales of the gods from the Greek pantheon
用语率性 诙谐风趣
with such a mixture of humour and levity and…
同时揭示了人类深层的悲剧因素
..at the same time, acknowledging the tragic elements of human beings
与众神的爱恨纠葛交织在一起
tangled up in the loves and affairs of the gods.
提香选择传达给菲利普的正是这些主题
And it was these subjects that Titian chose to send to Philip
现在我只想仔细研究这幅画
and I now just want to look at the picture
看看提香创作这幅画用了多少种工具
and see all the different tools that Titian has used
来使这个故事如此生动逼真 并且使我们感受到
to bring the story to life and to make us really feel…
各种不同又相互冲突的情感
..all sorts of different, conflicting emotions,
正如奥维德所写
just as Ovid did.
我觉得提香之所以这么推崇奥维德
And I think the reason that Titian loved Ovid so much
不仅因为奥维德作品里悲喜剧交融的风格
was that he was tragi-comic, yes,
但同时他也是用词
but he was also a poet that really used words
非常形象化的诗人
in a very, very visual way,
因此 提香作为一个画家
whereas Titian was a painter
能魔法般地把诗歌♥形象化
who could conjure up poetry visually –
这就是为什么 在这封著名的致菲利普的信里
and that’s why, in this famous letter to Philip,
他称这些作品是诗歌♥
he called these works “poems”.
我觉得现在我们坐在这里
And I think that as we sit there
还能感受到它发出的气息
and feel that lyrical quality emanating forth
所以也就能理解为什么它是诗歌♥
that we can understand why that was
以及它们为什么至今都被称为诗歌♥
and why they’re still called “poesie”, to this day.
今天的十分钟将讲述米开朗琪罗的作品埋葬
Today’s ten minute talk is on Michelangelo’s Entombment –
我身后的这个巨大作品就是
this large painting behind me.
这是国家美术馆藏品中一件相当奇特的作品
This is quite an extraordinary example of the National Gallery’s collection.
我不知道是否你们在看这幅画同时
I don’t know if any of you were looking at it
在想它看上去有些古怪
and thought that it looked a bit odd.
这幅画里确实有些相当奇怪的特征
There are some really quite unusual features in this painting.
举个例子 这也许不是最典型
It’s perhaps not the most typical way, for example,
表现主题的方式 而且
to represent the subject. And also…
我认为最让我注意到的 是它没有完成的部分
Well, I suppose what I most notice about it is its unfinished state.
这令人非常奇怪到底发生了什么
That’s quite a curious aspect of what’s going on.
我不知道你们怎么想 不过对我来说
I don’t know what you think, but for me, it’s really great to have
一幅存世五百年的画有着一直悬而未决的谜团是很有趣的
mysteries and questions hanging over paintings that are 500 years old.
因为有时 我们看着它们会想
Because sometimes, we tend to look at them and think
因为它们有五百年的历史
because they’re 500 years old,
我们所知道的就是去了解它们
we know everything there is to know about them.
当然 那是不可能的 因为我们每个人
And of course, that’s not the case and every single one of us
作为一个单独的个体 都会给像这样的一幅画赋予不同的故事
as an individual brings a different story to a painting like this
并且看到不同的东西
and sees something different.
我看到的是有人在用手♥机♥发短♥信♥
I absolutely do is see someone texting on a mobile phone.
当然 也许这根本不是其他人看到的
Of course, that’s probably not what everyone else sees at all,
不过 这正是画作吸引我们的地方
but that’s actually what can help keep these paintings alive for us –
关于作者本来意图的谜团
the mystery around what the artist had intended,
因为它并不是一直那么明显
because it’s not always completely obvious.
这就是我要讲的 如果你们有什么想问的 可以问了
I’m going to stop there. If you do want to ask questions, please do.
艺术家们都感兴趣的一点是
Something all artists are interested in is how
怎么让画作永不过时
painting can kind of freeze reality.
所以 即使有人去世很久 也仍通过画作看着我们
So, someone who died a long time ago is still here, looking at us.
比如这只大龙虾 曾经存活了很久
This lobster, which existed a long time ago,
可显然 现在早已不在了 它却活在了这幅画作中
which now doesn’t exist at all, of course – is here, preserved.
令人惊奇的保留方式 它就在这里
Amazing preservation and here it is.
这只牛角杯仍然存在
The drinking horn still exists.
这应该是唯一的事物 我猜
It is probably the only thing in the painting, I imagine,
依然存在的
that does still exist.
不过这就是一闪即逝的想法
But it’s that idea of something being ephemeral,
就像这个柠檬
something like a lemon.
艺术家们真的被类似的想法迷住了
And artists were really intrigued by the idea that they could do that –
他们觉得能把某个东西 真真正正地永远保存下去
preserve something for ever, really.
尽管不可能真的永久 却比我们存在的时间要久
Well, it won’t last for ever, but it’ll last longer than us,
除非发生了一些灾难
barring some disaster.
这是个有趣的想法
And that’s an interesting idea.
我和你讲个关于摩西的笑话
I’ll tell you a joke about Moses.
他上山去 这是虚构的
He goes up… This is not true.
他上山去 下来的时候带回来十诫
He goes up onto the mountain, comes down with the Ten Commandments
他喊来以色列人
and he gathers the Israelites around him.
他说 大伙儿 我上去过了 我和耶稣谈了一会儿
He says, “OK guys, I’ve been up there, I’ve had a word with him.
你们是想先听好消息呢 还是坏消息
“Do you want the good news, or the bad news?”
大家说 好消息
And they say, “Good news.”
好消息是 我说服他将戒律减少为十条了
“Good news is, I’ve got him down to ten.
坏消息是 通奸依然是十诫之一
“The bad news is that adultery is still on the list.”
尽管
Anyway…
这幅画几个月前被肆意破坏过
This painting got vandalised a couple of months ago.
一些疯子用红喷雾剂来攻击这里
Some crazy guy came in with a red aerosol.
幸运的是 整修团队立马介入了
Luckily, they got the restoration team in straight away,
把它拿下来 拿走 去整晚修复
took it down, took it away, worked all night –
第二天早上我来时 -复原了吗
and I came in the next morning and it was…- It was back up?
这真好 -是的 复原了 干净了 很完美
That’s really nice.- Yeah, it was back up, cleaned up, perfect.
不幸的是 这些事时不时就会发生
Sadly, these things happen from time to time,
而你只能去容忍♥
but you just have to learn to live with it.
现在 让我们来看看最后一幅克劳德的作品
Now, let me show you the last Claude,
因为这里还有个有趣的小故事
because there’s a nice little story attached to this one.
回到对华托的研究是基础原则
To come back to that research on Watteau was fundamental.
将这些作品聚在一起 也是重要因素
Bringing the works together was also an important element.