与安德烈晚餐（1981）

所以如果你的感知力-
so that if your– if your perceptions are —
如果你自己的机制运作正常的话
I mean, if your own mechanism is operating correctly…
去珠峰也就毫不相干了 而且有点荒唐
it would become irrelevant to go to Mount Everest, and sort of absurd…
因为-当然在某些方面
because, I mean — it just — I mean, of course, on some level, I mean…
它显然和第七大道上的雪茄店很不同
obviously it’s very different from a cigar store on 7 th Avenue.
可是- – 是的 沃利 我同意你说的
But I mean — – Well, I agree with you, Wally.
但问题是人们就是看不见雪茄店
But the problem is that people can’t see the cigar store now.
事物不能再像过去那样影响他们了
I mean, things don’t affect people the way they used to.
很有可能十年以后
I mean, it may very well be that 10 years from now…
有人会花一万美元现金去势
people will pay $10,000 in cash to be castrated…
就为了感受点儿什么
just in order to be affected by something.
为什么-你说为什么会这样？这是为什么？
Well, why–why do you think that is? I mean, why is that?
是因为人们如今懒吗 还是因为他们无聊？
I mean, is it just because people are lazy today, or they’re bored?
我们是否就像无聊的 被惯坏的小孩
I mean, are we just like bored, spoiled children…
整天就躺在浴缸里
who’ve just been lying in the bathtub all day…
玩他们的塑料鸭子？
just playing with their plastic duck…
现在他们又想“我♥干♥点什么好？”
and now they’re just thinking, “Well, what can I do?”
没错 好的 我们就是无聊
Okay. Yes. We’re bored.
我们如今全都很无聊
We’re all bored now.
可你是否想过 沃利 是什么样的进程
But has it every occurred to you, Wally, that the process…
制♥造♥了当下这种举世可见的无聊
that creates this boredom that we see in the world now…
它极有可能因为于一种自我延续的 不知不觉的洗♥脑♥
may very well be a self-perpetuating, unconscious form of brainwashing…
而这又出自 以金钱为基础的世界集权政♥府♥
created by a world totalitarian government based on money…
所有这些要比人们想象的危险的多
and that all of this is much more dangerous than one thinks…
它不仅仅是个人生存的问题 沃利
and it’s not just a question of individual survival, Wally…
更严重的是 无聊的人是麻木的
but that somebody who’s bored is asleep…
而麻木的人不会说不
and somebody who’s asleep will not say no?
我总是遇到这些人- 就在几天前
See, I keep meeting these people — I mean, uh, just a few days ago…
我遇见一位我很敬慕的人
I met this man whom I greatly admire.
他是个瑞典物理学家 古斯塔夫·布耶恩施特兰德 （疑取自演员甘纳尔）
He’s a Swedish physicist. Gustav Bjornstrand.
他告诉我他不会再看电视
And he told me that he no longer watches television…
也不读报纸不看杂♥志♥
he doesn’t read newspapers, and he doesn’t read magazines.
他的生活彻底戒掉了这些东西
He’s completely cut them out of his life…
因为他的的确确感到 我们如今活在某种奥威尔式的噩梦里
because he really does feel that we’re living in some kind of Orwellian nightmare now…
也就是说 你所听见的一切 都在将你变成一个机器人
and that everything that you hear now contributes to turning you into a robot.
我还在芬德霍恩那会儿 曾遇到 一位非凡的英国植物学家
And when I was at Findhorn, I met this extraordinary English tree expert…
他一辈子都致力于保护树木
Who had devoted his life to saving trees.
当时他刚从华盛顿回来 是去游说保护美洲红杉的
Just got back from Washington, lobbying to save the redwoods.
他已经84岁了 总是带着一个背包旅行
He’s 84 years old, and he always travels with a backpack…
因为他从不知道明天身处何方
’cause he never knows where he’s gonna be tomorrow.
我在芬德霍恩看到他时 他问我“你是哪里人”
And when I met him at Findhorn, he said to me, “Where are you from?”
我说“纽约” 他说“啊 纽约 那是个非常有意思的地方”
I said, “New York.” He said, “Ah, New York. Yes, that’s a very interesting place.
你是否知道 很多纽约人一直说着想离开 却从没行动？”
Do you know a lot of New Yorkers who keep talking about the fact that they want to leave, but never do?”
我说“没错” 他又问“你说他们为什么不走呢”
And I said, “Oh, yes.” And he said, “Why do you think they don’t leave?”
我发表了一番老生常谈 他说“喔 我认为完全不是那么回事”
I gave him different banal theories. He said, “Oh, I don’t think it’s that way at all.”
他说“我认为纽约是新式集中营的新典范
He said, “I think that New York is the new model for the new concentration camp…
囚犯们亲手筑造了这个集中营
“where the camp has been built by the inmates themselves…
而囚犯自己同时也是看守 他们为自己所建之物感到骄傲
“and the inmates are the guards, and they have this pride in this thing they’ve built.
正因为他们建造了自己的监狱
“They’ve built their own prison.
所以他们活在一种精神分♥裂♥中
“And so they exist in a state of schizophrenia…
既是警卫又是犯人
“where they are both guards and prisoners.
结果就是 他们不再- 变得麻木和迟钝以后-
“And as a result, they no longer have — having been lobotomized —
不再有能力离开自己造的监狱
“the capacity to leave the prison they’ve made…
甚至不再能看清这是所监狱”
or to even see it as a prison.”
然后他伸进口袋 掏出一颗树种
And then he went into his pocket, and he took out a seed for a tree…
说道“这是一颗松树”
and he said, “This is a pine tree.”
他把种子放进我手心 然后说 “逃走吧 趁着为时不晚”
He put it in my hand and he said, “Escape before it’s too late.”
说实话 这两三年来
See, actually, for two or three years now…
我和乔姬塔一直有种不舒服的感觉 就是我们真的该离开这地方了
Chiquita and I have had this very unpleasant feeling that we really should get out.
我们颇有30年代末德国犹太人的感受
We really feel like Jews in Germany in the late ’30s.
此地不宜久留
Get out of here.
当然 问题是去哪里
Of course, the problem is where to go.
因为 很明显整个世界都在殊途同归
‘Cause it seems quite obvious that the whole world is going in the same direction.
我觉得极有可能20世纪60年代
See, I think it’s quite possible that the 1960s…
代表了人类灭绝前的最终呐喊
represented the last burst of the human being before he was extinguished…
而它开启的是余下的岁月 现在 从今往后
and that this is the beginning of the rest of the future, now…
只会有一些机器人四下行走
and that from now on there’ll simply be all these robots walking around…
没有感情 没有思维
feeling nothing, thinking nothing.
又能剩下谁 去提醒他们
And there’ll be nobody left almost to remind them…
曾经有一个物种叫做人类
that there once was a species called a human being…
有着灵魂和思想
with feelings and thoughts…
就在此时此刻 历史和记忆正在被抹去
and that history and memory are right now being erased…
不久就没人能真正记得
and soon nobody will really remember…
这个星球上还存在过生命
that life existed on the planet.
当然 布耶恩施特兰德感到 这一切是无可救药的
Now, of course, Bjornstrand feels that there’s really almost no hope…
我们可能会倒♥退♥至一种非常野蛮
and that we’re probably going back to a very savage…
无法无天 恐怖的时代
lawless, terrifying period.
在芬德霍恩 人们的看法却稍有不同
Findhorn people see it a little differently.
他们认为到时会有一些星星之火
They’re feeling that there’ll be these pockets of light…
从世界的各个角落纷涌而出
springing up in different parts of the world…
而这些将会成为 某种意义上的世外桃源
and that these will be, in a way, invisible planets on this planet…
当我们和世界变得越来越冷
and that as we, or the world, grow colder…
我们能够拜访这些世外桃源
we can take invisible space journeys to these different planets…
补给一番 各取所需
refuel for what it is we need to do on the planet itself…
然后回到外面的世界
and come back.
他们感到是该有一些基地了
And it’s their feeling that there have to be centers now…
好让人们过来 为世界重建新未来
where people can come and reconstruct a new future for the world.
当我和古斯塔夫聊的时候
And when I was talking to, uh, Gustav Bjornstrand…
他说实际上 到处都有基地在形成了
he was saying that actually these centers are growing up everywhere now…
它们想做的 也就是芬德霍恩想做的
and that what they’re trying to do, which is what Findhorn was trying to do…
而且 可以说是我想做的-
and, in a way, what I was trying to do —
这些东西无法言说
I mean, these things can’t be given names…
但某种意义上 都是试图创立一种新式学校
but in a way, these are all attempts at creating a new kind of school…
或新式修道院
or a new kind of monastery.
古斯塔夫提到了“保护区”的概念
And Bjornstrand talks about the concept of”reserves” —
它是一种安全岛 在这里 历史得以被铭记
islands of safety where history can be remembered…
人类种群得以继续繁衍生息
and the human being can continue to function…
这样在黑暗的时代里 人类火种不灭
in order to maintain the species through a dark age.
换句话说 我们谈的是一种地下组织
In other words, we’re talking about an underground…
它在中世纪欧洲曾以不同面貌出现过
which did exist in a different way during the Dark Ages…
在那些教会的秘密团体中
among the mystical orders of the church.
我们说的地下组织
And the purpose of this underground…
意在想方设法去保存 光明 生命 文化
is to find out how to preserve the light, life, the culture…
如何使一切保持活力
how to keep things living.
我老觉得我们需要的是
You see, I keep thinking that what we need…
一种全新的语言-
is a new language —
一种心灵语言
a language of the heart…
像是在波兰的森林里 一种无需语言处的语言
a language, as in the Polish forest, where language wasn’t needed.
它是人和人之间 某种全新的诗
Some kind of language between people that is a new kind of poetry…
它是翩翩起舞的蜜蜂之歌♥ 向我们诉说蜂蜜在哪里
that’s the poetry of the dancing bee that tells us where the honey is.
而我认为要创造这种语言
And I think that in order to create that language…
你必须学会颠覆日常规则
you’re going to have to learn how you can go through a looking glass…
进入另一类知觉中
into another kind of perception…
你将感受到万物与我为一
where you have that sense of being united to all things…
然后你将豁然开朗
and suddenly you understand everything.
[远处警笛尖鸣声]
[Siren Wailing In Distance]
二位需要上甜点吗？
Are you ready for some dessert?
我要一杯浓缩咖啡 谢谢
Uh, I think I’ll just have an espresso. Thank you.
好的 – 我也要一杯 谢谢
Very good. – I’ll — I’ll also have one. Thank you.
对了 我可以再来一份意式苦杏酒吗？
And –And, uh, could I also have, uh, an amaretto?
当然可以 先生
Certainly, sir.
谢谢
Thank you.
你看 沃利 在芬德霍恩有一座神奇的建筑
You see, Wally, there’s this incredible building that they built at Findhorn.
设计它的人一辈子从未设计过任何东西
And the man who designed it had never designed anything in his life.
他是个儿童读物作者
He wrote children’s books.
有些人想用它做某种冥想礼堂
And some people wanted it to be a sort of hall of meditation…
其他人想把它作为讲堂
and others wanted it to be a kind of lecture hall.
可是社区里比较神的那些人 想赋予它另一种功能
But the psychic part of the community wanted it to serve another function as well…
因为他们希望它有点像飞船 到了夜里能升起来
because they wanted it to be a kind of spaceship which at night could rise up…
这样UFO就知道这是一个安全的降落点
and let the U.F.O.’s know that this was a safe place to land…